Never trust a man who starts a sentence with 'to be honest'.

Strike one up for the Xbox Defence Force! Boom!!

Waits patiently for PS4 Pro to become £230

Slap in the face? ha that;s funny.

Nintendo drop consoles completely after short amounts of time
Microsoft stuck a 4k Drive in their XBox One then announced a new system straight afterwards
PC video cards are updated every other month.

Isn;t this all a slap in the face too? actually it's quite the norm these days so this argument makes no sense at all

The PS4 is still the same console it was at launch, nothings changed and no one is forcing people to upgrade :smile:

Things have changed with consoles over the years, they are PC based now and it's not quite the same as the old 8bit, 16bit 32bit upgrades, you get marginal graphic improvements of the exact same games these days depending on the graphics hardware. How much improvement on those graphics depend on how much you want to spend. - if you're happy with your current graphics then it's as you were before!

I expect the same people who complain get a new phone every 12 months, but thats's not a slap in the face when a new phone comes out? or new tv etc... they could still watch TV on their old sets! and make calls on their old phones!.....it's all nonsense.

This is the way it will be now going forward and people need to get used to it.

Shopto.net same price with two games.

wow... the amount of energy being spent here arguing about gaming platforms etc... that time could be spent actually gaming on the device of your choice!

Oooft. .the fanboys are strong in this thread lol. People getting butthurt because someones bashing on their tech and everyone trying to justify why their (enter gaming platform and 4k TV here) is the best choice. So sad. Different folks...different folks.

If you dont want a gaming PC with a 1080Ti that can run 4k 60fps...dont buy one. Similary if you want something portable dont buy a ps pro or a gaming pc. Buy what you want and what makes you happy. Simple.

But the OG supports HDR, it was patched....... So not sure what the advantage of the Slim is (especially when its lost Optical output). I guess it saves a bit on the electricity bill compared to the OG.

Comparing video cards is a bit pointless, It's likely a CPU bottleneck rather than GPU.

This game is pretty poorly optimized

good deal, heat added,

Upscaled ps2 ps3 games look sharper on a ps4. So are we just getting the same again and being out of pocket here...

What untrue myths? PC gaming is a lot more expensive. PC gamers always use the excuse that games are more expensive on console than on PC, which is true but they leave out the bit that you have to be buying a ridiculous number of games to even make up the difference in the initial outlay!

Plus, budget conscious console gamers will wait for game prices to come down to reasonable levels and will sell it on after they are done so it doesn't even cost much in the end. Resale value of console games are much better as well.

Who cares about being able to play games on steam dating back to 2004?
Most people don't even have time to play recent releases let alone ancient games from the past. I have no idea why that would interest people. Each to their own.

Online gaming on PC is pants too. Full of cheaters.

Finally caved in and picking a month old boxed pro up today with receipt for £250 :smile:

On the subject on PS4 Pro power vs PC, here's Dark Souls 3 with it's newly unlocked framerate and Pro patch running worse at 1080p on the Pro than it does on a GTX 970 -

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jrR3ak6dMwM

Of course the Pro is still a lot cheaper than a PC though, and even though I'm a PC gamer I always buy the consoles too for the exclusives (aside from xbone which doesn't have any).

what they need to do is release Diablo on Switch

Interesting to see that the Nintendo Switch is only 3 quarters as important as Apple TV for gaming & gamers.

just change the graphics to rx480 or gtx 1060, i7 sandy is still a very capable cpu.

As a Pro owner I would love to agree with you but I'm afraid your wrong, Horizon Zero Dawn runs at 2160p Checkerboard.

There are native 4k games, but when you gain one thing you lose another, a bit like deciding what settings you run on a PC game, except in this instance its in the developers hands.

I really need a 4k tv, and maybe a holiday before I do anything.
Might take a look at building a new rig later on in the year.

The pro is excellent value for money. I can't say its massively better than the ps4 because I haven't compared them
Regarding the lack of 4K bluray on the pro. It's doesn't really matter as there's a lack of decent 4K blurays available. All are grossly overpriced and the majority of those that are available are ostensibly, B movies.
The pro is batter than the majority of PC that gamers play on.

The fanboy wars are strong in this comments section :laughing:

No I'm not and no it doesn't.

Active means people using the platform regularly (logged in within 2 weeks). You haven't done that on 5 accounts! :smiley:

You should read the article, it's quite interesting.

Like I said, I'm not here to troll the PS4 which I now think is a great system with some cracking games, just challenge some myths about PC gaming.

Haha that's the exact spec as my last rig, except I had a 570. :smiley:. Now have a 1080 which is awesome, playing games like BF1 which look incredible at 4k. Though gutted about the ti pushing my card down the ranks, tempted to sell and get one. It's an expensive hobby!

If you do it hold fire for a couple of weeks. AMD are finally releasing decent kit once again and it's bound to effect long term pricing.

You could also stick your old rig on eBay, you might get a couple of hundred quid back for it. I got £300 for mine but that was last spring.

Those figures mean nothing, i have about 5 steam accounts, don't use any of them though

Not really interested in reading that tbh :smile:

However the article heading states 'challenging' meaning it's not as large.....

and on that note.... i bid you a good day

Steam currently has 125m active users, League of Legends have 70m... That's 195m on two platforms!

For comparison PS network (both ps3 and PS4 users) has 111m

PC gaming is massive in 2017. Have a read of this:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/newsbeat/article/35714179/how-the-pc-gaming-industry-is-challenging-consoles-like-the-xbox-one-and-ps4

This graph doesn't really reflect much since games being developed for the PC with the developers knowing they can be ported over to the PS4 and Xbone alike, those figures showing PS4 and XBox are for games being developed primarily on those system.

Furthermore, lumping PC and Macs together?? and people who game, and don't game.... pointless and done just to fit the agenda of the article. Hell, if putting together Mac and PC, why not combine all consoles?

11m..... nothing to compare that with, but that's not that many when the worlds population is 7 billion

You won't convince me, i;ve had a PC for over 40 years, and every console since i bought a coleco vision

I can unplug my PS4 now, and carry it to another TV or round a friends house....... wouldn't be doing that with a desktop pc!

Think you just need to concede that PC's aren't for everyone, personally I understand them and can even code, but the average punter just wants to play games without the faff

Just wish every console thread wasn't filled with PC master racers, you;re almost as bad as doorstep preachers.

Yeah I did the exact same thing, overclocking and tweaking to marginally push up benchmark scores. I probably enjoyed that as much as gaming.

Current PC is getting on, has a decent PSU I could use but would need a new mobo, cpu and graphics card.
I7 2700k, 16GB ddr3 and GTX 580.

Give it a try, there is no written rule that you can't have both. I have no allegiance to any platform and currently have a PC, Xbox One and a Wii U. I also hope to get a pro at some point too.

Only downside with PC gaming as you can get a bit obsessive chasing FPS and 3Dmark scores. Sometimes you can spend a full evening benchmarking and tweaking your rig just to get an extra 2fps (which is pretty pointless!). It's fun for me but may not be for everyone :smiley:

To be honest, the visual benefits are minimal and the performance upgrade is negligible. Will wait for PS5.

My first shot at PC gaming was back when farcry 2 and cysis released, remember being blown away by the graphics and physics.
Not seen in game physics like that on any console.
For me that was tbe biggest leap Ive had in gaming, more so than PS1>PS2>PS3

My £1500 PC I built slowly became underpowered for modern games and I moved back to consoles

Now use PS4, graphics are great and its convenient but always wondering if im missing anything on the other side.

Really, this article from a renown business publication says your very wrong:

http://uk.businessinsider.com/most-popular-game-platforms-developers-chart-2017-3?r=US&IR=T

That was published last week.

Also just logged into Steam, 11m concurrent users. And that's just Steam, there is Origin, Uplay, GOG and Battlenet (Wow, Overwatch, Diabolo) all very active communities. And that's just people online at this very point in time.

One thing you can't say in 2017 is nobody plays PCs anymore :wink:

With tablets and smartphones the need for a Desktop PC is becoming less and less, and many people don't have Desktop PC's anymore.

I have a villa in Turkey and frequently travel to places all over the UK, the kids like to play games.

As i said, don't want to drop in a 200 video card.. PC gaming ain't for me, you don't seem to realise i have a PC and if i wanted
to use it for gaming i would, and have in the past.... not for me any more

Already have a switch, it's extremely lacking in power and limited to specific types of games.

So we have 200 quid for the card, and another 30 quid for a bluetooth pad...... all for what? slightly cheaper games that don't hold their value???? will just stick with a console thanks :smiley:

You take a PS4 on holiday? Lol it's not like you can play it on the plane, maybe get a Switch as that's perfect for out and about. Usually when I go on holiday staying in playing video games is the last of my priorities.

And to reiterate I said the PS4 Pro was a steal at its price and the PC is more expensive, I don't despute that. But people like you who have a relatively new PC can drop in a £200 graphics card, and if you wish a £30 Xbox Bluetooth pad and get comparable performance.

Like I said you can't compare but stepped in as so many untrue myths flying around about PC gaming.

What am i talking about? I want to take my PS4 on holiday with me, i can stream from my PC at home to my shield on holiday? no i can't i actually own a shield tv and my PC aint that bad, only an R9 in there but i know its limitations and the shield controller isn;t great, still able to stream to the shield despite having an AMD though, but over the internet...... no chance

Still have to find somewhere to store a bulky desktop PC though either way

Yes you can build a tiny PC, but at a cost. Why are you comparing a video card with an entire system anyway? that logic fails every time! 200 quid for the card...... what about the rest? and a wireless controller...... lol, you make me laugh

I got my pro for £299 from tesco at launch

A great bit of kit the PS Pro. If you don't have a 4K TV I wouldn't be in a rush though, 4K is where this machine thrives.

The PS Pro will stream in full 1080p though, which is great - https://www.youtube.com/user/PuckaMucka

Heat added for a great deal :smile:

What are you talking about? The Shield streams my PC from my office. I get true 4k gaming on a box the size of a mobile phone!

And yes, it is a lot more powerful. The PS4 Pro is about on par with a GTX 1060, a £199 graphics card. A 1080ti is 3x more powerful than a pro. Yes it's a lot more expensive, but I explained this in my post.

And a PC can look however you want. I personally prefer a beast of a tower with RGB lighting and water cooling. Bit of you like a minimal look you can build a tiny PC using an ITX board. But as mentioned I then stream it to my Shield anyway.

And I very rarely have issues with drivers, Geforce Experience takes care of it for you and even determines the settings for your games.

It's not a 'lot more powerful'

Let's not forget that the Xbox and the PS4 are PC based, and can effectively utilise any hardware that is available to the PC, it's built on a budget of course and a budget best managed for my liking, console games may be generally more expensive to purchase, but they also hold their value better than PC games and are more easily resell-able.

Yes, i have heard of the shield..... but that's nowhere near as powerful as a PS4, let alone a Pro... and other than dropping a few k on an expensive gaming laptop, PC's are bulky, and 'mostly' fugly and about as portable as the Kitchen sink. Had a gaming machine for many years, just not for me anymore. Fed up of updating drivers, dealing with random compatibility issues, mostly down to the fractured nature and vast amount of various hardware combinations possible.

PC owners should thank consoles really, because PC owners seem to expect to pay just a couple of quid for the latest games, then theres the piracy issue and software companies profit margins would be a lot less making games for just the PC market. Most game probably wouldn't be made if not for the other platforms.

PC Online gaming issues also with many cheats using bots and other software.

I agree as you can see from my post above.

Though would argue that you don't need to spend £2000+. You can probably build a comparable PC for about £700-800.

Unless your planning on running 2 x 1080ti's in SLI! Which to put in context would be 22 tflops of gaming power...

As a rule I usually spend around £1000 and it does me 3-4 years. I also reuse and sell components so cost is probably much lower.

No you can't compare. The PC is significantly more expensive but a lot more powerful and over the years the amount of money I've saved on games makes up for it.

On a PC you can pretty much play any game you have bought since 2004 through Steam (no matter how many times I upgrade).

It's a great time for PC gamers, not only do you have the multiplatform games and PC exclusives with both Microsoft play anywhere and PSnow you have access to a huge library of console exclusives. You can even play Breath of the Wild via CEMU!

And for people who say the PC is for the office, not controller compatible or big and bulky..Have you never heard of the Shield?

Not saying the PS4 Pro is a bad choice and for 4k gaming on a budget, it's a bit of a steal at this price. You also get PS4 exclusives today rather than waiting for them to be released to PSnow. And PC gamers have to wait for the inevitable definite edition of RD2

But if you have the cash for the initial outlay then you can't go wrong with a specced out gaming PC, you really can't.

For all those moaning about native 4k or not needing this - if you have a 4K TV, and are going to be playing either Mass Effect Andromeda or any game thats been patched to support the Pro and 4K, then this is essential if you are going to make good use of that nice 4K TV.

If you dont have a 4K tv, then fair play - dont bother if you dont care too much for Boost Mode.

Also, comparing the Pro console to a 4K gaming PC is just plain retarded - a Sub £400 console that can do 4k out of the box without any tinkering vs. a £2k+ gaming PC is a ridiculous comparison. You dont compare a Renault Sport Hot Hat to a Veyron. This is great value for what it is and does out of the box.

I dont get why so many people get into such a huff about this kind of thing.

i guess it's subjective but I've always found the natural home for Diablo to be PC. i think its custom made for mouse & keyboard, and with a controller it feels less strategic and more of a button masher.

the offset is it's just a good brainless lounge game on consoles, but find it strategically more gratifying on PC.

This man speaks common sense, I got a 4K TV last week and then upgraded to PS Pro straight after, I'm pretty much a big deal so this was a must for me.

If I had a normal HD TV i would have stuck with the normal PS4 simples

Well you are ill informed, HZD runs @ naitive 4K and with full HDR capability and it looks 3000 times better than anything on the XBONE which I own I might add, i mean can the XBONE run anything at 1080p yet, GLASS HOUSES AND ALL THAT,.

The vast majority of games will be 4K native going forward and let's not forget the better processing power and 60FPS

Sorry, for 4k TV owners I disagree, not all games are in 'faux' 4k, and the checkerboarding is very well done and very hard to tell apart from a native 4k


What difference has it made? standard PS4 exclusive games still being released as normal regardless of whether the Pro exists or not, and there are no Pro exclusive games..... besides the quality of the exclusives as always is subjective? - i have an Xbox One S and think the exclusives on that have been far worse, but not everyone agrees with that.

Sorry, fail to see your point here as any real argument to what i stated

The existence of the Pro does not impact negatively on standard ps4 owners, if you own a 4k TV and want to make more use of that then get a Pro, if not then don't! - If you don't want to buy a 4k TV, then don't! stick with 1080p! no one is forcing you to purchase anything.

Do PC owners get salty when a new video card comes out a few months after they spent a small fortune on the latest graphics card?

I welcome this new approach to console gaming and welcome the Scorpio and the Pro 2, or maybe the next one will be called the PS4 Elite, (doubtful it will be PS5 quite yet) who knows. It's far better than a console remaining stagnant for 5 or 6 years whilst technology leaves it behind. PC is all well and good, but isn't portable and is very cumbersome. Having a console platform which evolves with technology is much more appealing to me.

And if you don't want it, don't buy it!

You must have some odd games, there were 40+ games at launch with Pro support, I have 18 games and 11 have Pro support.

I've not experienced any problems with boost mode at all, currently playing "Just Cause 3" and it's as smooth as butter :smiley:

Why should it? There aren't really any '4K' blurays anyway! :/

Not really. It uses some clever tech to replicate a faux-4k image. It doesn't offer much over the original version apart from that.

That doesn't make it right or any more excusable. Releasing this 2.5 years after the original PS4 wasn't really justifiable especially considering the generally poor quality of exclusives on the PS4 over its first couple of years.

this wouldnt be a bad deal if they fixed the random black screen dropout issue I and quite a few others are having - If you have one of the effected TV's I would recommend avoiding the PS4 Pro at the moment.

More info here
http://community.eu.playstation.com/t5/PS4-Support/PS4-Pro-random-black-screen-dropouts/m-p/24693423

Got to agree with other posters, this was a HUGE letdown from SONY. The console needed a UHD blu-ray drive yet gets a standard blu-ray drive? Why throttle the console? If microsoft could do it with their standard console why couldn't Sony? We are now considering the Scorpio, but hopefully Sony sees the light & releases a new lite/upgraded version of their pro console with the uhd drive built in.

Yes what you say is true, that is the way it has been for TV's, phones and PC's everyone is used to that. Not consoles though, not a half upgrade a couple of years into the current generation. You are right also in that it is something that people (myself included) will have to get used to.

Thanks think that might be my best bet then and the prices may drop by then so may even get both. I've already got a ps4 slim and play HZD and I've also got an xbox one s and actually prefer playing on that tbh. Just didn't know whether it'll be worth it as only upgraded to my slim about a month ago :neutral_face:

May as well wait another 9 week's for the Scorpio reveal at the E3 show. If your not sure.

Oh and ignore the fanboy post above mine.

You can't play HZD/ Last Of Us 2 on Xbox Scorpio and you will be lukcy if we see it before 2018 and because its Microsoft it will either not work properly i.e Xbox One for the first 2 years or it will be faulty i.e Xbox 360.

Or you could buy a Pro which is massively powerful and enjoy the best games of this generation in 4K and HDR

Can't decide whether to get the pro and sell my slim or just put the extra money towards a Scorpio. Would prefer a deal like the 349 argos one a couple of weeks ago. Got a 55" 4k 10 bit Samsung tv so guessing I should see some difference

How so? Genuinely interested, I played for hours on the PS4 and couldn't get into it on PC. Seems clunky and a bit of a mess on PC.

One of the main reasons I bought a PS4 Pro was VR, it runs much better & smoother on the Pro.

Still a great game on consoles... I spent a huge chunk of January playing it on PS4 after the pro patch came out and it turned up in a PSN sale. It's a great game to just zone out with on the couch with a controller. Consoles have seasons now too starting with 10...

I'll probably end up getting the Necromancer for PS4 instead of PC

Really? There is quite a few games with pro support now. Horizon Zero Dawn not appealing to you?

Picked up a PS Pro last week and I have been playing Horizan Zero Dawn, the 4K and HDR make this game look amazing and well worth the upgrade!

As an owner of a Pro and a 4K HDR 10-bit TV, I'd say the console is worth it over the original by a large amount, I would never go back to a regular PS4 ever again, the difference to me is so big.

Maybe you need to replace your budget 4K TV if it seems 'unstable'? It is certainly not the console being unstable, I am yet to notice a game being unstable due to this console.

Boost mode is a huge feature from Sony and it does what it says on the tin to a lot of games. Grand Theft Auto V gets a noticeable boost while you're driving around in cars. Fifa sticks to it's locked FPS limit with no slow downs. Rocket League is now in full 4K resolution and locked to 60fps and looks gorgeous compared to the 1080p version.

Obviously I don't play every game but it is down to the developer of the game to produce Pro patches, most games are developed to have a 30fps limit on consoles. It is completely down to the developer of games to take advantage of this console. Most are not doing so, yet.

All in all, I don't see the issue with this console - it should have had a 4K blu-ray player included, but it's still worth the extra money. Try upgrading your PC's graphics/CPU to offer you more than double the power for £100-150 extra, it's impossible. Give it 6 months and developers will design games primarily for the power of the Pro and give regular PS4 owners a basic 30fps version.

1.6GHz 8-core AMD Jaguar & 1.84 TFLOP AMD Radeon - PS4 Original/Slim
2.1GHz 8-core AMD Jaguar & 4.2 TFLOP AMD Radeon - PS4 Pro

I've got a PS4 pro and it's been nothing but well worth the money. I own a 4KTV and PSVR. Zero Dawn looked amazing in 1800p render to UHD. I would like to say more about it but I'm still sulking at MEA being pants. SO glad I didn't buy that game on my PC, at least now I can sell it on.

Check out Redout if you like Wipeout, game is crazy fast. Out on PC right now but coming to consoles soon.

Slap in the face? ha that;s funny.

Nintendo drop consoles completely after short amounts of time
Microsoft stuck a 4k Drive in their XBox One then announced a new system straight afterwards
PC video cards are updated every other month.

Isn;t this all a slap in the face too? actually it's quite the norm these days so this argument makes no sense at all

The PS4 is still the same console it was at launch, nothings changed and no one is forcing people to upgrade :smile:

Things have changed with consoles over the years, they are PC based now and it's not quite the same as the old 8bit, 16bit 32bit upgrades, you get marginal graphic improvements of the exact same games these days depending on the graphics hardware. How much improvement on those graphics depend on how much you want to spend. - if you're happy with your current graphics then it's as you were before!

I expect the same people who complain get a new phone every 12 months, but thats's not a slap in the face when a new phone comes out? or new tv etc... they could still watch TV on their old sets! and make calls on their old phones!.....it's all nonsense.

This is the way it will be now going forward and people need to get used to it.

I think he is digging at it because the halfway 4K console was poor idea and a slap in the face to people who purchased the original console.

Also like slannmage said;
"
slannmage Avatar
slannmage5 hours, 36 minutes ago#34
REPLYREPORTLIKEIGNORE
As an owner of a Pro and a 4K TV, I'd say the console is not worth it over the original. There has just been nothing I've played with supports it, Sony patched in boost mode, it seemed unstable to me like using SLI on a PC or something. On top of that no 4K blu-ray player means I have to use my Xbox One S to play my 4K Blu-rays, so you cannot even use it for that.

I haven't' been impressed, but obviously if you don't ow a PS4 yet, then don't buy the Slim, buy this one, especially since the Slim has no optical out."
The console should have had a 4K Blu Ray drive.

Some games are native 4k, and some are 4k checkerboard. It's hard to compare directly as games are optimized differently and the best looking PS4 games are usually the exclusives

However, since the PS4 platform is PC based after all, this should answer your questions on what it can / can't do according to your requirements

4.12 TFLOPS, 218 GB/s, 8GB GDDR5

I'm not debating ones better than the other or comparing prices, I'm just interested how good the 4K is on the PS4 in comparison with 4K on a PC... e.g. Is the PS4 graphics comparable to playing on low-medium-high-ultra settings.. is it actually 4K bla bla

Still waiting for a white ps4 pro!

I've a PS4 slim and having been playing Horizon Zero Dawn on a 4K TV. The difference even the HDR makes on the original PS4 is unreal. Unsure if purchasing a PS4 Pro would be worth it for the extra boost as this looks enough. Good price for a PS4 Pro but think i'll hold off until the next generation on console arrives.

2-3 years ago? - PC struggles with 4k gaming now, even with the latest graphic hardware. If your card was only around 300 quid, it surely wasn't the best around at the time.

Not that the Pro is a bona fide 4k gaming machine mind you.

Which video card is it? and once again, how much was the PC??

By the way the comparison is mostly pointless because consoles are portable, and look a damn sight better than a PC would, and take up much more space....can i fit your 2-3 year old PC into my holdall and carry it with my on holiday?

Controllers do work on PC. Just pointing it out.

I don't think so, it is genuine interest how good the PlayStation is, and it if looks anything like a pc game in 4k.

PC is about 2-3 years old now, the graphics card on its own when bought was not far off a PS pro though !

As an owner of a Pro and a 4K TV, I'd say the console is not worth it over the original. There has just been nothing I've played with supports it, Sony patched in boost mode, it seemed unstable to me like using SLI on a PC or something. On top of that no 4K blu-ray player means I have to use my Xbox One S to play my 4K Blu-rays, so you cannot even use it for that.

I haven't' been impressed, but obviously if you don't ow a PS4 yet, then don't buy the Slim, buy this one, especially since the Slim has no optical out.

Hopefully there's better deals on the Pro this easter. This price with Horizon thrown in and I'd probably bite.

​Diablo on pc is far superior imo

ordered :smile:

Waits patiently for PS4 Pro to become £230

Interested in how these new consoles compare to my gaming pc in running 4k.

Pretty certain my comp has much more processing power - wonder how much that translates to on screen though

I've got a GTX 1080 enabled PC but with so many quality games on the PS4 Pro at the moment, I'm not using it. Currently loving Horizon, Diablo 3 in 4k using a controller is also amazing. Uncharted 4 before these two.....

Technically you soon will be able to with PlayStation Now.

Cold PlayStation but heat for a good deal

I was joking :smiley:

It's a pretty high end machine though so it will be interesting to see the actual price.

The Xbox One got released with a price of around £430 and failed miserly because of it. So I assume Microsoft know they need to keep below that price. So I'm guessing a price of £399. Definitely won't be £660.

Damm I'm getting closer to pulling the trigger.Soon as it hits £300 I'm in.

​Hahaha made me giggle

Why? it will still be half the price of the Scorpio :laughing:

Almost there... just waiting for £300 or this price with a decent game. Heat

Will get a PS4 pro when Wipeout Omega comes out, hopefully a nice price drop in 4 months time :smile:

thanks :smile:

Not that I don't trust you but a) that's a time machine comment and 2) right now, infamous is £34.99 in Game and d) who really cares anyway ... :smirk:

To be honest, InFamous is a launch title and I picked up a new copy from Game pre-Christmas for £4.99

To be honest, you might be right.

It needs a couple of games thrown in as well, then I'll say it's a good deal.

Never trust a man who starts a sentence with 'to be honest'.

Certainly Sir - http://www.game.co.uk/en/ps4-pro-1tb-with-infamous-second-son-and-playstation-plus-3-month-membership-1857617 & http://www.game.co.uk/en/playstation-4-pro-1tb-with-infamous-second-son-and-now-tv-2-month-sky-cinema-pass-1774756

PS4 Pro 1TB with inFAMOUS: Second Son and PlayStation Plus 3 Month Membership - £349

or

PlayStation 4 Pro 1TB with inFAMOUS: Second Son and NOW TV 2 Month Sky Cinema Pass - £349

To be honest, the extras are barely worth £20, so in my opinion, it's effectively the same.

Maybe the cheapest standalone but can be had with a game and a now tv/ psn sub which is worth the extra £20 at Game for £349.99...